New Subject
This post will probably enrage all my ORTHODOX Catholic friends nearly as much as my prior posts. However, I'm going on to an entirely new topic and question.
I've been considering the sacraments. Again, spending time talking with Dan on the issue of Confirmation spurred some of this reflection. My thoughts have to deal with the communal nature of our sacraments. In Baptism, we welcome the individual into our Christian community, so it's helpful for this to be a public celebration with the community present. In Eucharist, we recieve Christ and celebrate this activity in a public liturgy, again, in the midst of our community. Obviously, Confirmation further initiates the candidates into the community. Marriage and Holy Orders seem pretty public and communal also. In the new rites for Anointing of the Sick, community participation is also encouraged.
You can see where I'm going with this, right? Should Reconciliation be encouraged under (what's it called?) Form 3? Should this sacrament have a more communal nature also? I'm not talking about everyone shouting out their sins, but why is this the only sacrament not celebrated in community?
Okay, have at it.
I've been considering the sacraments. Again, spending time talking with Dan on the issue of Confirmation spurred some of this reflection. My thoughts have to deal with the communal nature of our sacraments. In Baptism, we welcome the individual into our Christian community, so it's helpful for this to be a public celebration with the community present. In Eucharist, we recieve Christ and celebrate this activity in a public liturgy, again, in the midst of our community. Obviously, Confirmation further initiates the candidates into the community. Marriage and Holy Orders seem pretty public and communal also. In the new rites for Anointing of the Sick, community participation is also encouraged.
You can see where I'm going with this, right? Should Reconciliation be encouraged under (what's it called?) Form 3? Should this sacrament have a more communal nature also? I'm not talking about everyone shouting out their sins, but why is this the only sacrament not celebrated in community?
Okay, have at it.
posted by CAL at
9:14 PM
18 Comments:
What about communal reconciliation servieces??? You still do reconciliation privately on your own, but celibrate as a community too.
By
Emily Powell, at 10:03 PM
That's kinda my point. ORTHODOX Catholics totally dis a communal celebration of the sacrament. And I'm really asking about using the form that allows for a "general absolution" without individual confessions required.
By
CAL, at 10:14 PM
Ok - after going to a Canon Law class that was on my birthday for the whole day and learned some rule and some kool points.. let's talk
This sacrament which is by the farest the 3 hightest, but ranked 2 needs to be private if you have broke a major commandment, but if you have just lied or u know like us the great name in vien then go to the communal confession. There is nothing wrong with. I used to go the the community cofession, but now it part of the RE program and so I go with the class. It's good that way it show the kids that we 'too' have sined and need to be forgiven.
By
Unknown, at 11:04 PM
I'm gonna go ahead and propose that confession should be entirely communal. I've read Brother's Karamozov; I know that each one of us is responsible for each other - basically, sin is communal. (For more information and a more coherent explaination, read the Brother's K, particularly the parts with Father Zosima). Anyways, sin is communal - it hurts the individual and thereby the community. It also hurts the community more directly. It hurts Christ, neccesitates the crucifixtion, etc. It's all tied together. And so maybe, since sin is communal, confession should be too. Maybe we should all be willing to just share our deepest sins outloud with the rest of the community, full of the knowledge that we need forgivness and that the community will (or at least should) give it. This is actually a really cool idea. Very revolutionary. Very cool. Go Mom.
By
Matthew B. Novak, at 11:30 PM
If you didn't think people went to confession enough as it is now try telling them they'll have to shout it out in a room full of people. Oh I'm sure they'll be fine with it.
By
Alan, at 1:54 AM
If so many people fear public speaking or whatever and would rather say their sins in private. How come Catholics are the only ones to have private confession? Even our closely related religions don't have private confession and think we are weird for having it private. So maybe if we didn't say our sins but rather did it like Lutherans it would be better to do it public.
By
Kendrick Novak, at 10:06 AM
Hey mom, this has nothing to do with your post but I think Eric is really expecting to get a fruitcake for Christmas. Isn't he weird. :)
By
empeterson, at 11:39 AM
yeah, he im'd me and said that we were getting fruitcakes?
By
Alan, at 2:15 PM
this is an interesting proposal... i think that my ideas side with MJ on this one. That is what i have grown up with, and understand. I am not apposed to communal, but i guess that when i think about it i come back to the whole reason why we go to confession in general. the whole what you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven and what you bind on earth you bind in heaven.... i am not apposed to anything like what matt has stated, but like alan and josh, i dont think it will happen, at least not as our society is now.
And i am expecting a fruit cake.....
By
Eric Michael Peterson, at 7:46 PM
Why would anyone want a fruitcake? Unless you were going to give it away as a gift like you are suppose to. Hmm, Eric are you just going to waste a "good" fruitcake? (Check out that oxymoron)
By
Kendrick Novak, at 8:14 PM
On my dad's side of the family we've been giving the same fruit cake back and forth for the last 3 years.
By
Alan, at 8:57 PM
I'm not talking about praticality, I'm talking about the theology/philosophy behind it. I don't care that people wouldn't be immediately open to this, I just care that it has some deep appeal. And, to understand that appeal better, I'm just gonna reccommend to everyone that they read the Brother's K. Then you'll understand better. So: Read Brother's Karamozov. I'll loan you a copy. Of course, you should read Crime and Punishment first, because jumping into Brother's K could be a bit of a shock. Crime and Punishment is a terrific introduction to Dostoevsky, and ultimately will help you ease into Brother's K. I'll loan you Crime and Punishment too if you want.
By
Matthew B. Novak, at 9:36 PM
Who's got time to read anything "extra"? Even if it would be helpful.
Okay, okay, I'll try to get to this. Bring home your books.
By
CAL, at 10:21 PM
wow, i'm correcting you spelling matt???? never thought the day would come..... Dostoyevsky.... that is the correct spelling....
my experience with him is limited to "notes from the underground" and while it was not horrible i think there are a great deal of better philosophers out there...
By
Eric Michael Peterson, at 10:44 PM
Ya, I'm with Eric, Josh, and Alan on this one...Just don't see it as happening. I can't say I'd be comfortable with the idea...but I suppose that's part of the point. But either way I don't see that happening the way people are today...
By
Emily Powell, at 10:52 PM
oh i forgot to mention.... i agree with matt, i just dont think it would ever happen. in an ideal world, (which would never exist if we are going down the dostoyevski road.) it would work and it sounds like a good idea in theory.
By
Eric Michael Peterson, at 11:10 PM
Eric - Actually, when it comes to Russian/English translations, particularly translations of names, there are often several correct spellings of a word. 'Dostoevsky' is one of the correct forms for his name. But so was yours. I think it's a function of alphabets - they don't use the same one that we do.
Miss Emmie Rose - You're at St. Ben's. See if you can take a class from Scott Richardson. He teaches Latin and Greek, but also does other stuff from time to time. Particularly Great Books, and Mythology. I had him for symposium and Great Books, where we read Crime and Punishment and Brother's K, respectively. I also had the chance to take an entire Dostoevsky course with Scott, so I read both of those books a second time, in addition to almost all of his other stuff. Scott is absolutely brilliant - find out what he's teaching next year, and see if you can get into it.
By
Matthew B. Novak, at 12:03 AM
Josh, I think he's saying they don't have confession at all. Matt, I have a lot of free time at school (yay, Gina was so right!) so I would totally love to read those books. And I will be home nearly all of January so I will really have a lot of time! Bring them home! Thanks.
By
empeterson, at 2:24 PM
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